Seth Young.

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Pound Foolish
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One word: BOOOOOOOOO. Seriously though, his immaturity, confusion, and over-dedication make for a hilarious character, if a somewhat annoying one, perhaps. And, hey, without him, Mandy and Liz wouldn't have had that great cat-fight. :)
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PS. The question is, theologically speaking, what's a lie? A lie, for technical definition is an untruth, but that's different from theologically. For instance, the technical definition of a body is a living organism or a board of directors, or group, or machine, or what have u. Theological definition: God, and all of, the whole world, in one body of Christ, a bond we will all share even more strongly in Heaven! :) Thus, perhaps, theologically, saying a lie is an untruth is too simplistic. Would it be a lie to tell a Nazi no Jews are in your house? Or your boyfriend you really did enjoy that heavy metal concert? ;) Perhaps a lie is really an untruth to someone who has an absolute right and/or need to know the truth. That said: Seth is WEIRD. :)
“I absolutely demand of you and everyone I know that they be widely read in every [censored] field there is: in every religion and every art form and don’t tell me you haven’t got time! There’s plenty of time.”~ Ray Bradbury
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Tea Ess
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I happened across this topic and thought that it looked like an unfinished debate. I was thinking, and like The Old Judge said, Seth was pretending to be someone he was not, and therefore lied. However, I was also thinking that Seth had a very effective plan there. One of the best ways to get to know people is through showing interest in their interests. Seth should have said up front that he was not a gardener, but it should be fine to give someone the recognition they deserve. I would also have to listen to the episode over again before I could make a firm decision on this, though.
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ArnoldtheRubberDucky
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Hmm... You may be right, T.S. Perhaps it wasn't Seth's approach that was so bad, it was just how far he took it. I think it's fine to express an interest in other's interest for the purpose of evangelism, as long you still are able to be yourself an make it clear that you're, as you said 'not a gardener'.
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Novatom
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Seth is a weird character. He lied to try to get people to become Christians, which doesn't make any sense. Why did Mandy like him anyway?
Last edited by Novatom on Mon Oct 13, 2014 9:48 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Bethany Shepard
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I agree, Novatom. That and he was just irritating. Which would have made him and Mandy such a great couple! *eye twitches*
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Bethany and Novatom, you both pretty much ignored the entire conversation. The whole point is no one has yet shown that Seth lied. Just saying he's lying won't make us magically change our minds.
“I absolutely demand of you and everyone I know that they be widely read in every [censored] field there is: in every religion and every art form and don’t tell me you haven’t got time! There’s plenty of time.”~ Ray Bradbury
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Rosy
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No matter whether Seth was "lying" or not, he wasn't being totally truthful. And this one aspect of him leads me to find him one of the worst characters on AiO yet. (Though he was knocked up a few notches when Maureen came along..) Plus, his voice is annoying, and he's kinda bratty.
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Bethany Shepard
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Thank you, Ro. U get a star sticker! :lol:
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I want to be Bob Denver on acid playing the accordion."
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Samantha14
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Pound Foolish wrote:Bethany and Novatom, you both pretty much ignored the entire conversation. The whole point is no one has yet shown that Seth lied. Just saying he's lying won't make us magically change our minds.
*Cough* Nothing but the half truth *Cough*
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Mickey
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I dooooooooo not like him :x
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TigerShadow
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As a person, there's no other conclusion to which I can arrive than immense dislike. However, as a character? Love him.

Seth as a character is designed to show Aubrey (and of course the audience) how not to evangelize—he deliberately deceives others into thinking that he is someone he's not in order to get close to them. Instead of bonding over a truly shared interest or trying to connect with the person emotionally, he considers people to be targets and objects, and believes that one can simply do a kind of Mad Libs evangelism on them to make them come to know Christ.

Yes, he's wildly over-the-top, ostentatious about his faith, and as of "Tuesdays With Wooton", a real jerk. But the thing is, we probably all know a Seth—or we might even be a Seth. There are plenty of people in plenty of churches who think evangelism is all about ticking down marks on a checklist and making a person come to Christ by whatever means necessary instead of developing an actual relationship with the person. There are also plenty of people—and I've seen similar behavior in my own youth group—who will invite others to a church event, like Seth did to Grady, for the sole purpose of getting points for some stupid "competition" in their Sunday School class and then completely ignore them later. It's very true to life to see someone like Seth—who is either very sincere but is misguided, or is just outright fake—and that might be another reason why we hate him—we know or know of people who are very similar.

I also discussed a theory with a fellow ToOer over PM that Mandy's and Liz's attraction to Seth might have had less to do with who he was and more to do with the fact that Seth might have been really good-looking. This isn't confirmed in-show, but it isn't unheard of for a middle school girl to be attracted to a boy purely because he's good-looking; the fact that he was a really showy Christian might have sealed the deal for Mandy because, let's face it, a twelve-year-old girl isn't going to know any better—she might have assumed that he fit the "cute Christian guy" stereotype and that therefore he was "the one" or something. It's just a theory, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were true.
Pound Foolish wrote:Would it be a lie to tell a Nazi no Jews are in your house? Or your boyfriend you really did enjoy that heavy metal concert?
Yes, it would. But in the former case, it is the lesser of two evils, because by telling the truth you condemn the people you're hiding to torture and near-certain death; in the latter case, you don't have to tell your boyfriend that you liked the concert, just that you enjoyed being with him and doing something he liked (unless of course, you didn't enjoy that either, in which case it is questionable why the two of you are dating in the first place). In that situation, it's worse to lie to someone to make them feel better or make them think something about you that isn't true than it is to tell them flat out that you can't stand heavy metal—although again, you shouldn't do either simply as a matter of courtesy.
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Like I said He stinks!
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John Henry
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Seth is a hypocrite! Plus, "small" lies are sins, and he justifies them? Sorry if I was strong about this, and no offense to all who like him. I don't.
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Novatom
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Pound Foolish wrote: The whole point is no one has yet shown that Seth lied. Just saying he's lying won't make us magically change our minds.
You want an example of him lying, PF? He lied to Nick, saying he was born in New York and played football, when he hadn't. There are many other examples, but I just don't get how you can think he didn't lie when he obviously did.
17:39<Novatom>: I'm in another boat. A boat of people who don't know what everyone's talking about. A boat that is sinking.
17:40<Sameriazx>: oh no... here we go again...
Mickey
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Like the time he said he loved flowers when he didn't?!
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Novatom
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Yes, exactly.
17:39<Novatom>: I'm in another boat. A boat of people who don't know what everyone's talking about. A boat that is sinking.
17:40<Sameriazx>: oh no... here we go again...
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Why all the unnecessary hate on Seth? =/
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